Naeso/Dictionary/Proposed words: Difference between revisions

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*(violates phonotactics —FH)
*(violates phonotactics —FH)


{{V|-tsi|FH=y|JH=y|}}
{{V|-tsi|FH=y|JH=y}}
{{V|-bim|MJ=y|FH=y|JH=n}}
{{V|-bim|MJ=y|FH=y|JH=n}}


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==Proposed content words==
==Proposed content words==
===hovercraft===
{{V|kunoy'apfe|JH=y|FH=n|BF=y|ES=n}}
{{V|kunoypavi|ES=y|JH=n|FH=y|RJ=y|BF=y}}


===balloon, dirigible===
===balloon, dirigible===
Line 63: Line 59:
===to fly===
===to fly===
{{V|pavi|FH=y|JH=n|RJ=y|BF=y}}
{{V|pavi|FH=y|JH=n|RJ=y|BF=y}}
===to fly (powered/guided flight, as birds, butterflies, airplanes, dirigibles)===
{{V|temya|JH=y|RJ=y|FH=y|BF=y}}
===to fly (ballistic flight)===
{{V|meumi|JH=y|RJ=y|FH=y|BF=y}}


===airplane, dirigible===
===airplane, dirigible===
{{V|kunoytemya|JH=y|RJ=y|FH=y}}
{{V|kunoytemya|JH=y|RJ=y|FH=y}}
===spaceship===
{{V|kunoymeumi|JH=y|RJ=y|FH=y|BF=y}}


===to want===  
===to want===  
Line 80: Line 67:
*I suggest using a desiderative mood affix like bornfor's proposed "-im" with the main verb, rather than a dedicated "want" verb. To say you want a thing rather than want to perform an action, put the "-im" suffix on an "acquire" or "possess" or "eat" or "drink" etc. verb. —JH
*I suggest using a desiderative mood affix like bornfor's proposed "-im" with the main verb, rather than a dedicated "want" verb. To say you want a thing rather than want to perform an action, put the "-im" suffix on an "acquire" or "possess" or "eat" or "drink" etc. verb. —JH
**This suffix is already voted in, so I second this —[[User:Fenhl|Fenhl]] 07:04, 23 October 2010 (PDT)
**This suffix is already voted in, so I second this —[[User:Fenhl|Fenhl]] 07:04, 23 October 2010 (PDT)
===duck (animal)===
{{V|anka|FH=y|JH=y|RJ=y|BF=y}}
*Yes, I am aware that the swedish word for "duck" is also anka, but pronounced differently. No one complained about lol either. —[[User:Fenhl|Fenhl]] 07:04, 23 October 2010 (PDT)
===house, building, permanent structure===
{{V|kyba|JH=y|FH=y|RJ=y|BF=y}}


===public, free===
===public, free===
Line 104: Line 84:
{{V|kunoypimum|FH=n|JH=n|RJ=n|BF=n}}
{{V|kunoypimum|FH=n|JH=n|RJ=n|BF=n}}
{{V|kyba kunoypimumbi|JH=y|FH=y|RJ=n|BF=y}}
{{V|kyba kunoypimumbi|JH=y|FH=y|RJ=n|BF=y}}
===to sit===
{{V|Mansu|FH=y|JH=y|RJ=y|BF=y}}
*(just because I am voting yes on the word doesn't mean I approve of capitalizing all verbs [[User:Jim Henry|Jim Henry]] 16:51, 23 October 2010 (PDT))


==Colors==  
==Colors==  


*I suggest letting "dol" cover orange and yellow as well as what we call "red" in English. —JH
*I suggest letting "dol" cover orange and yellow as well as what we call "red" in English. —JH
*I suggest we let dol be red, and not orange/yellow. We should have six main colors, plus things like black and white. —FH
*I suggest we let dol be red, and not orange/yellow. We should have six main colors, plus things like black and white. —[[User:Fenhl|Fenhl]]
 
===orange===
{{V|nhunh|FH=y|BF=y|JH=n|RJ=n|ES=n}}
 
*I cannot pronounce that... -RJ
**Good thing we agreed on allowing idiolects. —[[User:Fenhl|Fenhl]] 18:33, 18 October 2010 (PDT)
 
{{V|nunh|FH=y|RJ=y|ES=y|JH=n|BF=y}}


===yellow===  
===yellow===  
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{{V|[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Postfix_notation postfix]|FH=n|JH=n|RJ=y|BF=n}}
{{V|[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Postfix_notation postfix]|FH=n|JH=n|RJ=y|BF=n}}


E.g., supposing that "bvi" gets voted in for "and", then for each of those possible positions we would express "red and blue" as:
E.g., for each of those possible positions we would express "red and blue" as:
* '''prefix:''' bvi dol gel
* '''prefix:''' bvi dol gel
* '''infix:''' dol bvi gel
* '''infix:''' dol bvi gel
* '''suffix:''' dol gel bvi
* '''suffix:''' dol gel bvi


Postfix notation seems very out of place re: Naeso's VSO and head + modifier order.  Prefix notation could be interesting, but I am worried that it would be unclear when it affects something more than a pair of single words (two prepositional phrases, two clauses...).  I'm voting for infix conjunctions for now, but I might change my vote if someone proposes a good way to disambiguate prefix conjunctions with phrases or clauses. --[[User:Jim Henry|Jim Henry]] 10:12, 23 October 2010 (PDT)
*Postfix notation seems very out of place re: Naeso's VSO and head + modifier order.  Prefix notation could be interesting, but I am worried that it would be unclear when it affects something more than a pair of single words (two prepositional phrases, two clauses...).  I'm voting for infix conjunctions for now, but I might change my vote if someone proposes a good way to disambiguate prefix conjunctions with phrases or clauses. --[[User:Jim Henry|Jim Henry]] 10:12, 23 October 2010 (PDT)
 
*It probably makes no sense to vote yes for postfix but I like its Forthyness. ''(unsigned comment by RJ)''
It probably makes no sense to vote yes for postfix but I like its Forthyness. ''(unsigned comment by RJ)''
*Fenhl has proposed a sentence on the Sentences pages showing how a prefix "or" conjunction could be disambiguated in some cases with a subordinating/relativizer conjunction. --[[User:Jim Henry|Jim Henry]] 18:44, 23 October 2010 (PDT)
 
**
Fenhl has proposed a sentence on the Sentences pages showing how a prefix "or" conjunction could be disambiguated in some cases with a subordinating/relativizer conjunction. --[[User:Jim Henry|Jim Henry]] 18:44, 23 October 2010 (PDT)
 
===and===
{{V|bvi|FH=y|JH=y|RJ=y|BF=y}}
 
===and/or===
{{V|dzo|FH=y|JH=y|RJ=y|BF=y}}
 
===exclusive or / unless===
{{V|pfe|FH=y|JH=y|RJ=y|BF=y}}


==Suggestion list==
==Suggestion list==

Revision as of 12:36, 25 October 2010

List all unapproved words here (alphabetically when possible for ease of searching) until they're voted in. We are always voting on how to translate a given English word. Vote in the section below this, and remember to remove the word from this list once it's either voted in or voted out. Thanks!

Proposed suffixes

associative plural

-lun — 0/0 (0/0)
  • wouldn't this come in conflict with endings in -n? -ES
    • I don't think so. —Fenhl 17:52, 22 October 2010 (PDT)
-dun — 0/0 (0/0)
same as additive plural — 0/0 (0/0)
no associative plural — 0/0 (0/0)

genitive+plural

  • This is supposed to work with all plural forms: additive, collective and associative.

-sti - **voted out**

  • (violates phonotactics —FH)
-tsi — 0/0 (0/0)
-bim — 0/0 (0/0)
  • why not -bin or -bun? —ES
-bin — 0/0 (0/0)
-bun — 0/0 (0/0)

present tense

  • (aspect? WTF. Someone please name this right, as I really don't know how it should be. - BF)
-su — 0/0 (0/0)
  • (Remember that it's not yet decided whether we will suffix aspect on verbs or tense particles —FH)
  • (Or something else, like using adverbs for aspect. The first phase of that vote is going on now on the Grammar page. But I don't see a reason not to propose these affixes now and show examples of their use on the Sentences page. And maybe if we end up not having inflectional aspect, always marked on every verb, we can still have some specific derivational aspect suffixes (like e.g. English or French or Esperanto's "re-" prefix; that's derivational, not inflectional like aspect in Russian or Volapük).—JH)
    • TODO move this discussion to Grammar page and add a vote rubric for it
  • See the Sentences page to view proposed examples of how the aspect suffixes might be used and vote on them.

Proposed grammatical particles

temporal preposition

fyu — 0/0 (0/0)
fui — 0/0 (0/0)
  • This can be used for stuff like four weeks ago or next month. How exactly these will be translated is not yet defined. —Fenhl 17:09, 17 October 2010 (PDT)

Interrogative pronoun

poynh — 0/0 (0/0)
  • examples: ku poynh = who, pan poynh = what, fyu poynh = when Fenhl 17:09, 17 October 2010 (PDT)
  • I think it would make sense to describe this as an interrogative pronoun, indifferent to IRC/sex/animacy gender, than a "question particle". I also propose that it be used after nouns to mean "which X?". Jim Henry 16:49, 18 October 2010 (PDT)
    • I totally agree. —Fenhl 17:05, 18 October 2010 (PDT)

locative preposition

so — 0/0 (0/0)
  • examples: so inna = there, so ua = here, so Lutetsia = in/near Paris, so Iakobo = at Jim's/where Jim is —Fenhl 11:20, 23 October 2010 (PDT)

Proposed content words

balloon, dirigible

kunoypavi — 0/0 (0/0)

to fly

pavi — 0/0 (0/0)

airplane, dirigible

kunoytemya — 0/0 (0/0)

to want

sidu — 0/0 (0/0)
  • I suggest using a desiderative mood affix like bornfor's proposed "-im" with the main verb, rather than a dedicated "want" verb. To say you want a thing rather than want to perform an action, put the "-im" suffix on an "acquire" or "possess" or "eat" or "drink" etc. verb. —JH
    • This suffix is already voted in, so I second this —Fenhl 07:04, 23 October 2010 (PDT)

public, free

  • free as in "free software", not "free of charge"
pimum — 0/0 (0/0)
nhu — 0/0 (0/0)
  • nhu like GNU, get it? ~RJ

public transportation vehicle

  • bus, train, subway, …
kunoy pimum — 0/0 (0/0)
kunoy nhu — 0/0 (0/0)

public transportation station

  • train station, bus station, …
kunoypimum — 0/0 (0/0)
kyba kunoypimumbi — 0/0 (0/0)

Colors

  • I suggest letting "dol" cover orange and yellow as well as what we call "red" in English. —JH
  • I suggest we let dol be red, and not orange/yellow. We should have six main colors, plus things like black and white. —Fenhl

yellow

djy — 0/0 (0/0)
dy — 0/0 (0/0)

logic

position

prefix — 0/0 (0/0)
infix — 0/0 (0/0)
postfix — 0/0 (0/0)

E.g., for each of those possible positions we would express "red and blue" as:

  • prefix: bvi dol gel
  • infix: dol bvi gel
  • suffix: dol gel bvi
  • Postfix notation seems very out of place re: Naeso's VSO and head + modifier order. Prefix notation could be interesting, but I am worried that it would be unclear when it affects something more than a pair of single words (two prepositional phrases, two clauses...). I'm voting for infix conjunctions for now, but I might change my vote if someone proposes a good way to disambiguate prefix conjunctions with phrases or clauses. --Jim Henry 10:12, 23 October 2010 (PDT)
  • It probably makes no sense to vote yes for postfix but I like its Forthyness. (unsigned comment by RJ)
  • Fenhl has proposed a sentence on the Sentences pages showing how a prefix "or" conjunction could be disambiguated in some cases with a subordinating/relativizer conjunction. --Jim Henry 18:44, 23 October 2010 (PDT)

Suggestion list

If you've grown attached to a certain word or phrase and want it included in the lex, but don't have the faintest idea about what you want it to mean, list it here. We'll consider this the 'grab bag'- other people can look here for inspiration and develop words or phrases off of the ones here, or use them in their entirety. Please do not vote below!

  • bendiza
  • ete
  • kaminto
  • kaminhto
  • pulthy
  • teinen
Naeso
General:Voting • Member list • An Introduction to Naeso
Phonology and orthography:Phonology • Stress • Orthography • Transliteration
Grammar:Grammar • Suffixes • Prepositions
Lexicon and corpus:Naeso-English • English-Naeso • Proposed words • Swadesh • Names • Corpus of Sentences • Math
Conlang relay torches:LCC4 Relay
This page is part of the project Naeso. We meet up to discuss changes in 'real time' in #naeso on Freenode.
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